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Post by history2b on Dec 25, 2023 16:17:07 GMT -8
I just think Boston is a vastly superior team to ours right now. well yeah but there are breakdowns absolutely everywhere. we got Bron having an uncharacteristic shooting game and AD is the only player having a good game besides Prince Lebron not being LeBron today hurt badly. I counted 5 or 6 missed layups and then those costly turnovers.
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Post by lakeshow on Dec 25, 2023 16:17:08 GMT -8
And the fact that we let them get out to a 12-0 lead at beginning of the game I believe set the tone of the game in Boston’s favor.
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Post by history2b on Dec 25, 2023 16:24:50 GMT -8
And the fact that we let them get out to a 12-0 lead at beginning of the game I believe set the tone of the game in Boston’s favor. In some ways but I don’t think it mattered at halftime. We closed that 2nd quarter and it was a 1 point game. We lost control of game in the 3rd and then lost it all in that stretch in the middle of the 4th. Lebron making multiple mistakes were fatal as were some of DLo’s mistakes. Rui shooting for shit hurt too.
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philfar
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Post by philfar on Dec 25, 2023 16:25:15 GMT -8
Pretty disappointing game. After the comeback, I thought they have a chance but the intensity and the concentration was not there. Oh well, at least we won the in season tournament (sarcasm)! As it stands, I'd be pretty surprised if we make any noise this year either.
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Post by lakeshow on Dec 25, 2023 16:34:05 GMT -8
And the fact that we let them get out to a 12-0 lead at beginning of the game I believe set the tone of the game in Boston’s favor. In some ways but I don’t think it mattered at halftime. We closed that 2nd quarter and it was a 1 point game. We lost control of game in the 3rd and then lost it all in that stretch in the middle of the 4th. Lebron making multiple mistakes were fatal as were some of DLo’s mistakes. Rui shooting for shit hurt too. That's true, but the energy, focus, and fight it takes to get back into the game like that takes away from you in the 2nd half of the game imo.
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Post by samadams10 on Dec 25, 2023 21:20:40 GMT -8
This is the game AD needs to show up. He did. Still lost
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Post by samadams10 on Dec 25, 2023 21:20:50 GMT -8
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Post by odogg on Dec 26, 2023 7:27:19 GMT -8
Yes, I agree with Odogg, but what happened to Wood? He started off the season pretty good, but now it seems like he has been less and less of a factor. I can’t watch most the games. He played pretty well for the first 5-6 games then was exposed for all the things that have been true about him for many years. He’s slow in his movements, this includes closing out on rebounds, how he switches on defense and his offense is mostly limited to isolation 1 on 1. When he was doing well he was hitting spot up 3s and using length along with AD on the boards. When we tried to recreate that magic moving forward he exposed that he’s not capable of consistently making those things happen. Yeah Wood has been a 4 alongside AD, not a 5. This leaves us with Jax who is more of an insurance big.
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Post by history2b on Dec 26, 2023 15:22:52 GMT -8
I don’t think so. Sucking is Detroit Pistons. We lost to the best team in basketball because they are a level above us currently. They balled out last season too then flamed out at the end of the season while we sucked at the beginning and surged at the end. We didn’t get smashed by 20 or 30, the game was competitive the whole way thru until the last 3-4 minutes when it was clear Boston was going to hang on. I still don’t like the offense we run but some of its problems were Lebron looking old and coming up short. I don’t think that is a sign of his decline so much as it was playing long hard game vs OKC 2 days before, traveling back to LA, having his Christmas with family then playing early yesterday. Even though AD played well I still am not keen on the idea of playing thru him unless he becomes a passer in the post and a better ball handler. Everyone standing around while we force feed him doesn’t build that kinetic energy that generates that connectivity on the floor. I’m almost tempted to say Lebron should play the post not AD because running those action sets like the Celtics did to us all 4th quarter is a great way to break down a modern defense imo.
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Post by lakeshow on Dec 26, 2023 19:47:15 GMT -8
I don’t think so. Sucking is Detroit Pistons. We lost to the best team in basketball because they are a level above us currently. They balled out last season too then flamed out at the end of the season while we sucked at the beginning and surged at the end. We didn’t get smashed by 20 or 30, the game was competitive the whole way thru until the last 3-4 minutes when it was clear Boston was going to hang on. I still don’t like the offense we run but some of its problems were Lebron looking old and coming up short. I don’t think that is a sign of his decline so much as it was playing long hard game vs OKC 2 days before, traveling back to LA, having his Christmas with family then playing early yesterday. Even though AD played well I still am not keen on the idea of playing thru him unless he becomes a passer in the post and a better ball handler. Everyone standing around while we force feed him doesn’t build that kinetic energy that generates that connectivity on the floor. I’m almost tempted to say Lebron should play the post not AD because running those action sets like the Celtics did to us all 4th quarter is a great way to break down a modern defense imo. I agree with this. While I know Odogg may have said this in jest out of frustration, I‘ve been saying that our biggest problem is coaching, not the roster. This team can beat elite teams and has played well enough to win the in season tournament. The roster is not perfect, but it’s a solid roster that can make it to the Finals if it is coached right and if we stay healthy. Darvin Ham is not the guy though and that reason alone is why I’m skeptical about our chances of doing anything significant in the post season—if we even make it to the playoffs. That may sound extreme, but it’s possible to not even make it if LeBron misses games due to injury or if his body is compromised by April because he had to play too many minutes in the regular season just to carry us into the playoffs.
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Post by history2b on Dec 26, 2023 20:08:56 GMT -8
I don’t think so. Sucking is Detroit Pistons. We lost to the best team in basketball because they are a level above us currently. They balled out last season too then flamed out at the end of the season while we sucked at the beginning and surged at the end. We didn’t get smashed by 20 or 30, the game was competitive the whole way thru until the last 3-4 minutes when it was clear Boston was going to hang on. I still don’t like the offense we run but some of its problems were Lebron looking old and coming up short. I don’t think that is a sign of his decline so much as it was playing long hard game vs OKC 2 days before, traveling back to LA, having his Christmas with family then playing early yesterday. Even though AD played well I still am not keen on the idea of playing thru him unless he becomes a passer in the post and a better ball handler. Everyone standing around while we force feed him doesn’t build that kinetic energy that generates that connectivity on the floor. I’m almost tempted to say Lebron should play the post not AD because running those action sets like the Celtics did to us all 4th quarter is a great way to break down a modern defense imo. I agree with this. While I know Odogg may have said this in jest out of frustration, I‘ve been saying that our biggest problem is coaching, not the roster. This team can beat elite teams and has played well enough to win the in season tournament. The roster is not perfect, but it’s a solid roster that can make it to the Finals if it is coached right and if we stay healthy. Darvin Ham is not the guy though and that reason alone is why I’m skeptical about our chances of doing anything significant in the post season—if we even make it to the playoffs. That may sound extreme, but it’s possible to not even make it if LeBron misses games due to injury or if his body is compromised by April because he had to play too many minutes in the regular season just to carry us into the playoffs. I agree with you that we’d be in big trouble if Lebron (or AD) sustained a significant injury but that has more to do with the fact that it’s the most competitive NBA in history and most competitive conference in history. The margin of error is slim. That said, Darvin is clearly not a top 5 coach and doesn’t have the potential to reach it no matter what he does imo. He deserves his share of criticism but I do see some problems with the roster now that we’ve fleshed out some games. 1) we miss Dennis Schroder. While I was ok seeing him leave because he’s not a great 3p shooter and he tends to be a little ball dominant, we miss his playmaking and grit. Of course if Gabe Vincent actually played some we may not feel this void but Gabe isn’t the playmaker Dennis was and it hurts. 1b) While the FO draft history since Jimmy boy was ousted has been outstanding. But this year they swung and missed badly with Hood Schifino. It’s unfair to sell him short without giving him room and time to grow but when the 2 picks immediately after him are producing in bunches for Miami and GS, it’s clear we missed out on immediate impact players both of whom could have helped this team. Podziemski is the one we should have taken. He’s a scrappy playmaking guard, who handles passes, shoots and defends well. He’s basically better than Gabe Vincent as a rookie and he without question could have fit this team well. 2) we have a solid roster with depth and size but we still miss the void left by the pre-Westbrook trade players. KCP was an elite defender and elite 3p shooter. Caruso was an even better defender and has proven to be an elite 3p shooter in his own right. When we look at our roster now we’ve basically desperately tried to film their voids to no avail besides the development of Reaves who is fantastic but not the defender either of the other 2 were. 3) we still lack that physical big man we had in 2020. I always preferred Dwight to Javale but seeing Javale thrive to this day for other teams shows me we could have used his presence.
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Post by lakeshow on Dec 26, 2023 20:32:20 GMT -8
I agree with this. While I know Odogg may have said this in jest out of frustration, I‘ve been saying that our biggest problem is coaching, not the roster. This team can beat elite teams and has played well enough to win the in season tournament. The roster is not perfect, but it’s a solid roster that can make it to the Finals if it is coached right and if we stay healthy. Darvin Ham is not the guy though and that reason alone is why I’m skeptical about our chances of doing anything significant in the post season—if we even make it to the playoffs. That may sound extreme, but it’s possible to not even make it if LeBron misses games due to injury or if his body is compromised by April because he had to play too many minutes in the regular season just to carry us into the playoffs. I agree with you that we’d be in big trouble if Lebron (or AD) sustained a significant injury but that has more to do with the fact that it’s the most competitive NBA in history and most competitive conference in history. The margin of error is slim. That said, Darvin is clearly not a top 5 coach and doesn’t have the potential to reach it no matter what he does imo. He deserves his share of criticism but I do see some problems with the roster now that we’ve fleshed out some games. 1) we miss Dennis Schroder. While I was ok seeing him leave because he’s not a great 3p shooter and he tends to be a little ball dominant, we miss his playmaking and grit. Of course if Gabe Vincent actually played some we may not feel this void but Gabe isn’t the playmaker Dennis was and it hurts. 1b) While the FO draft history since Jimmy boy was ousted has been outstanding. But this year they swung and missed badly with Hood Schifino. It’s unfair to sell him short without giving him room and time to grow but when the 2 picks immediately after him are producing in bunches for Miami and GS, it’s clear we missed out on immediate impact players both of whom could have helped this team. Podziemski is the one we should have taken. He’s a scrappy playmaking guard, who handles passes, shoots and defends well. He’s basically better than Gabe Vincent as a rookie and he without question could have fit this team well. 2) we have a solid roster with depth and size but we still miss the void left by the pre-Westbrook trade players. KCP was an elite defender and elite 3p shooter. Caruso was an even better defender and has proven to be an elite 3p shooter in his own right. When we look at our roster now we’ve basically desperately tried to film their voids to no avail besides the development of Reaves who is fantastic but not the defender either of the other 2 were. 3) we still lack that physical big man we had in 2020. I always preferred Dwight to Javale but seeing Javale thrive to this day for other teams shows me we could have used his presence. Darvin’s not even top 20.
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Post by history2b on Dec 26, 2023 20:47:00 GMT -8
I agree with you that we’d be in big trouble if Lebron (or AD) sustained a significant injury but that has more to do with the fact that it’s the most competitive NBA in history and most competitive conference in history. The margin of error is slim. That said, Darvin is clearly not a top 5 coach and doesn’t have the potential to reach it no matter what he does imo. He deserves his share of criticism but I do see some problems with the roster now that we’ve fleshed out some games. 1) we miss Dennis Schroder. While I was ok seeing him leave because he’s not a great 3p shooter and he tends to be a little ball dominant, we miss his playmaking and grit. Of course if Gabe Vincent actually played some we may not feel this void but Gabe isn’t the playmaker Dennis was and it hurts. 1b) While the FO draft history since Jimmy boy was ousted has been outstanding. But this year they swung and missed badly with Hood Schifino. It’s unfair to sell him short without giving him room and time to grow but when the 2 picks immediately after him are producing in bunches for Miami and GS, it’s clear we missed out on immediate impact players both of whom could have helped this team. Podziemski is the one we should have taken. He’s a scrappy playmaking guard, who handles passes, shoots and defends well. He’s basically better than Gabe Vincent as a rookie and he without question could have fit this team well. 2) we have a solid roster with depth and size but we still miss the void left by the pre-Westbrook trade players. KCP was an elite defender and elite 3p shooter. Caruso was an even better defender and has proven to be an elite 3p shooter in his own right. When we look at our roster now we’ve basically desperately tried to film their voids to no avail besides the development of Reaves who is fantastic but not the defender either of the other 2 were. 3) we still lack that physical big man we had in 2020. I always preferred Dwight to Javale but seeing Javale thrive to this day for other teams shows me we could have used his presence. Darvin’s not even top 20. I think outside the top 5-6 it doesn’t matter that much but I see him more middle of the pack. 12-18 range. Still, I’ll take him over Frank Vogel. Even moreso, that’s another FO swing and miss. It’s crystal clear that the NBA is undergoing a massive evolution right before our eyes with how the game is played. That to me means you had better vet someone for their ideas on how the game should be played and how they intend to use the players on the roster. Steve Kerr for example was vetted by GS on what he would do different than what Mark Jackson was doing. He had imagination that Mark lacked and he proved to changed the game by doing so. On our team Vogel was stubbornly running predictable sets all the way til the bitter end like a fucking buffoon and he’s hilariously doing the same in Phoenix now. I did like some of the changes Darvin immediately made just over a year ago but now with the roster reshaped and the scapegoat (Westbrook) removed the pressure is different. I would have preferred to see an elite veteran assistant coach with offensive acumen to help design/ guide a new strategy on offense.
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philfar
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Post by philfar on Dec 26, 2023 22:30:26 GMT -8
If Mike Budenholzer would be willing to come in as assistant coach for just one year (and that's a big IF), that may address the shortcomings on the coaching end for the short term. There is obviously a good level of familiarity between Ham and Budenholzer, so there would be no learning curve and he would be able to contribute immediately.
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Post by samadams10 on Dec 26, 2023 23:26:45 GMT -8
I don’t think so. Sucking is Detroit Pistons. We lost to the best team in basketball because they are a level above us currently. They balled out last season too then flamed out at the end of the season while we sucked at the beginning and surged at the end. We didn’t get smashed by 20 or 30, the game was competitive the whole way thru until the last 3-4 minutes when it was clear Boston was going to hang on. I still don’t like the offense we run but some of its problems were Lebron looking old and coming up short. I don’t think that is a sign of his decline so much as it was playing long hard game vs OKC 2 days before, traveling back to LA, having his Christmas with family then playing early yesterday. Even though AD played well I still am not keen on the idea of playing thru him unless he becomes a passer in the post and a better ball handler. Everyone standing around while we force feed him doesn’t build that kinetic energy that generates that connectivity on the floor. I’m almost tempted to say Lebron should play the post not AD because running those action sets like the Celtics did to us all 4th quarter is a great way to break down a modern defense imo. I agree with this. While I know Odogg may have said this in jest out of frustration, I‘ve been saying that our biggest problem is coaching, not the roster. This team can beat elite teams and has played well enough to win the in season tournament. The roster is not perfect, but it’s a solid roster that can make it to the Finals if it is coached right and if we stay healthy. Darvin Ham is not the guy though and that reason alone is why I’m skeptical about our chances of doing anything significant in the post season—if we even make it to the playoffs. That may sound extreme, but it’s possible to not even make it if LeBron misses games due to injury or if his body is compromised by April because he had to play too many minutes in the regular season just to carry us into the playoffs. I certainly didn't agree out of jest or frustration. Those are some huge IFs. Expecting this team anchored around streetclothes AD and an amazing yet very much aging LeBron plus a proven average coach at best are two very important pieces. While the mid point tournament win was a nice surprise, we are no longer the Lakers that used to wipe their asses with conf final banners. Now we revel in a meaningless mid season banner. I hope they can turn it around but overcoming injuries on this old team and coaching challenges is indeed a tall order.
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Post by shaolinfighter on Dec 27, 2023 5:59:15 GMT -8
I do like the DLo coming off the bench move but the rotations are still out of whack imo. For some reason Ham is playing Reaves less and less and we need him on the court - preferably not at the same time as DLo for a good chunk of his mins.
Reaves and/or Rui may need to back into the starting lineup. Rui needs more mins and Cam has been getting more minutes than Austin.
At this point, especially with Vincents injury and now surgery, signing him and letting Dennis walk away is biting us in the ass a little bit as well. We have 1 point guard (DLo) and he has been demoted so we really only have half a point guard.
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Post by odogg on Dec 27, 2023 7:02:22 GMT -8
I don’t think so. Sucking is Detroit Pistons. We lost to the best team in basketball because they are a level above us currently. They balled out last season too then flamed out at the end of the season while we sucked at the beginning and surged at the end. We didn’t get smashed by 20 or 30, the game was competitive the whole way thru until the last 3-4 minutes when it was clear Boston was going to hang on. I still don’t like the offense we run but some of its problems were Lebron looking old and coming up short. I don’t think that is a sign of his decline so much as it was playing long hard game vs OKC 2 days before, traveling back to LA, having his Christmas with family then playing early yesterday. Even though AD played well I still am not keen on the idea of playing thru him unless he becomes a passer in the post and a better ball handler. Everyone standing around while we force feed him doesn’t build that kinetic energy that generates that connectivity on the floor. I’m almost tempted to say Lebron should play the post not AD because running those action sets like the Celtics did to us all 4th quarter is a great way to break down a modern defense imo. I agree with this. While I know Odogg may have said this in jest out of frustration, I‘ve been saying that our biggest problem is coaching, not the roster. This team can beat elite teams and has played well enough to win the in season tournament. The roster is not perfect, but it’s a solid roster that can make it to the Finals if it is coached right and if we stay healthy. Darvin Ham is not the guy though and that reason alone is why I’m skeptical about our chances of doing anything significant in the post season—if we even make it to the playoffs. That may sound extreme, but it’s possible to not even make it if LeBron misses games due to injury or if his body is compromised by April because he had to play too many minutes in the regular season just to carry us into the playoffs. Lol yeah we were down like 12-0 when I wrote that.
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Post by history2b on Dec 27, 2023 14:57:03 GMT -8
If Mike Budenholzer would be willing to come in as assistant coach for just one year (and that's a big IF), that may address the shortcomings on the coaching end for the short term. There is obviously a good level of familiarity between Ham and Budenholzer, so there would be no learning curve and he would be able to contribute immediately. I don’t think Bud would ever do that and will likely get hired very soon. Possibly by the Suns if they wake up and fire Vogel in time. But I also don’t think his offense is his strong suit.
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Post by history2b on Dec 27, 2023 14:59:31 GMT -8
I do like the DLo coming off the bench move but the rotations are still out of whack imo. For some reason Ham is playing Reaves less and less and we need him on the court - preferably not at the same time as DLo for a good chunk of his mins. Reaves and/or Rui may need to back into the starting lineup. Rui needs more mins and Cam has been getting more minutes than Austin. At this point, especially with Vincents injury and now surgery, signing him and letting Dennis walk away is biting us in the ass a little bit as well. We have 1 point guard (DLo) and he has been demoted so we really only have half a point guard. DLo is not a starter point guard on a championship team, period. He’s a starter on a non contender or he’s a backup. Moving him to the bench has allowed him to play against 2nd units and he looks fine doing that. It’s really just a matter of who we’re going to flip him for at this point. Dejounte Murray is the latest rumor and I would do cartwheels if that happened.
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Post by history2b on Dec 28, 2023 18:49:13 GMT -8
Celtics and Pistons going down to the wire right now.
Shao’s boy Cunningham just blocked Tatum’s drive toe game under 10 secs but it was rules goaltend. It was as close as can be whether it was block or goaltend. Refs couldn’t overturn cause it was too close.
Pistons down 2 8.7 to go.
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