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Post by chiefsdodgerslakers24 on Apr 22, 2024 22:49:19 GMT -8
anyone want to count how many times Jokic traveled in this highlight video. answer is somewhere between 2 and 6 times. don't want to bore anyone with specifics but the most egrigious one is a minute in
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Post by shaolinfighter on Apr 23, 2024 5:10:09 GMT -8
You can point to the difference in the way the Nuggets and Lakers were officiated and how it affected the game, how it took points off the board, how it neutered our only defensive player in AD, how it gave the Nuggets whistles that the Lakers didn't didn't get on the other end.
And while it's a valid point imo you have to point more to the way the Lakers played as if they were scared to play the way they played to get their lead, how they played as if they wanted to just run the clock out starting from the mid 3rd Q onwards, how it gave Denver time to rest on defense which gave them more energy to get going on offense and see light at the end of the tunnel. This is an awful coaching strategy and what leads to an opportunity for the refs to have an impact on the game.
Imo it was also a critical mistake to play that lineup with Dinwiddie in the 2nd half. You have a 18-20pt lead and you as a coach in Game 2 down 0-1 decide to fk around and give your horses too much rest in a game you have to steal and have 3 days of rest to recover from after. You have to use your timeouts to give your horses rest and you have to go all out for these kind of games in Denver. Ham finished the game with 2 timeouts and zero challenges used. Reaves is 25 years old, he doesn't need an extended rest in the 2nd half in that kind of game when your other option is Dinwiddie. Shorten the rotation, play the right way and get the job done.
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hackashaq
::| Basketball Guru |::
Posts: 3,212
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Post by hackashaq on Apr 23, 2024 10:45:37 GMT -8
You can quibble about the officiating, but this is the 6th time in the playoffs that we were competitive or actually beating Denver going into the 2nd half, and this time around, you had a double digit lead going into the 4th...a substantial lead at that.
Championship teams close, so the Lakers have proven they are not a championship team. But championship coaches also know how to squeeze that last bit of advantage to get the Jon done. Time and time again, in crucial times where the team needed an extra boost, and timely stop, Ham has been unable to scheme something up to give the Lakers a chance.
Yes, players have to play, but you have to (a) have the right players play, and (b) create matchup schemes to maximize player advantages and minimize players weaknesses.
Ham clearly can't do that. When the margin for error is 0, and you are losing games in these margins, the coaching has to step in.
Ham is turning into a mini-version of Doc Rivers. Can't close. Can't keep leads. Coaches afraid or not-to-lose instead of coaching to win.
Lebron taking the last second 3 pointer and AD being the close out guy at the three point line against Murray just doesn't make sense. How was that allowed to happen.
Yes, the players are accountable, but you got production from nearly everyone, and you couldn't close.
And this is rinse and repeat time. Rinse and repeat. It's a pattern.
I kinda want to blow this thing up and suffer the next 3-4 years in a rebuild. Ham was a coach you get with a young team that wants to over achieve, not for a veteran team you need to work on scheming at the highest levels against playoff teams and talent.
Let him coach a bunch of lovers and be happy with a 36-46 record.
Not a talented team that needs to have a cohesive coach that knows what he's doing with franchise players like AD and Lebron.
So freaking frustrated. I don't want anything to do with this team with Ham coaching.
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Post by history2b on Apr 23, 2024 11:04:28 GMT -8
I’m still not ready to talk about last nights loss.
Among the worst in franchise history imo.
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Post by shaolinfighter on Apr 23, 2024 11:37:27 GMT -8
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Post by chiefsdodgerslakers24 on Apr 23, 2024 11:55:39 GMT -8
regular occurance with the Lakers. this shit happens every game
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Post by history2b on Apr 23, 2024 12:35:01 GMT -8
You can quibble about the officiating, but this is the 6th time in the playoffs that we were competitive or actually beating Denver going into the 2nd half, and this time around, you had a double digit lead going into the 4th...a substantial lead at that. Championship teams close, so the Lakers have proven they are not a championship team. But championship coaches also know how to squeeze that last bit of advantage to get the Jon done. Time and time again, in crucial times where the team needed an extra boost, and timely stop, Ham has been unable to scheme something up to give the Lakers a chance. Yes, players have to play, but you have to (a) have the right players play, and (b) create matchup schemes to maximize player advantages and minimize players weaknesses. Ham clearly can't do that. When the margin for error is 0, and you are losing games in these margins, the coaching has to step in. Ham is turning into a mini-version of Doc Rivers. Can't close. Can't keep leads. Coaches afraid or not-to-lose instead of coaching to win. Lebron taking the last second 3 pointer and AD being the close out guy at the three point line against Murray just doesn't make sense. How was that allowed to happen. Yes, the players are accountable, but you got production from nearly everyone, and you couldn't close. And this is rinse and repeat time. Rinse and repeat. It's a pattern. I kinda want to blow this thing up and suffer the next 3-4 years in a rebuild. Ham was a coach you get with a young team that wants to over achieve, not for a veteran team you need to work on scheming at the highest levels against playoff teams and talent. Let him coach a bunch of lovers and be happy with a 36-46 record. Not a talented team that needs to have a cohesive coach that knows what he's doing with franchise players like AD and Lebron. So freaking frustrated. I don't want anything to do with this team with Ham coaching. Nothing wrong with AD guarding Murray on the final play. Would I have preferred Vando? Of course but he’s not here. Would I prefer Alex Caruso? You betcha but… AD and Lebron defended Jokic and Murray down the stretch so that when the P&R came we had our 2 best defenders switching off. No other 2 players on the roster could do this. Use Gabe Vincent and he’s bbq chicken on a Jokic switch and the boards. Murray and Jokic are just better than Lebron and AD, period. I’d have liked to see AD get more extension on that contest but it was a tough cover and great execution by Kobe Bryant fan Jamal Murray. AD had his chance to prove he is the best defender in the NBA and he failed. He’s still among the best and very valuable for us but he’s not who he claimed he is. Jokic Hakeem Olajuwon’d him on the previous play.
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Post by shaolinfighter on Apr 23, 2024 13:31:17 GMT -8
Was a nasty (great) big grizzly bear move by Jokic. Not sure if AD could do anything about that or not but he was absolutely neutered with 5 PF and didn't want to get fouled out. He always plays defense differently when he is on the brink of fouling out in a close game for this team and can't blame him. 2 of those 5 fouls were absolute shit calls imo but again they shouldn't have even been in a close game.
Not sure what happened to Rui but dude is officially shitting the bed at this point. 38 minutes played, 3 points scored on 1-7 FG and 3 of those were point blank. Vando may return as the team is desperate but idk if he can help at all as he'd be jumping into a demanding playoff series right from the jump. Same with Wood.
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Post by lakeshow on Apr 23, 2024 13:59:36 GMT -8
I've not commented about these games, because like 2b said, it's been too painful. But all I can say is that I'm ready for this page to turn.
If you can't win a game up by 20 points in the 3rd quarter of a game you had to have, then you don't deserve to win--period. I don't care how many calls the refs missed either. I don't want to hear about any refs, because they can't be an excuse at this point. You either get the job done or you don't. You either overcome bad calls or you don't. Otherwise, you just sound like a 2002 Sacramento King fan--they're still crying about 2002. And I'll just say it now--this is the difference between Lebron and Kobe. Kobe would not allow his team to lose a game like this--NEVER. I'm not letting Ham off the hook either, but superstar players of Lebron's magnitude simply do not let their teams lose a 20 point lead and lose in the playoffs.
It's darn near impossible to overcome a 2-0 deficit in the way the Lakers have lost these 2 games. So, this series is over, even if they get a win at home.
I'm ready to move on to the next chapter of the Laker franchise.
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Post by history2b on Apr 23, 2024 14:00:15 GMT -8
Was a nasty (great) big grizzly bear move by Jokic. Not sure if AD could do anything about that or not but he was absolutely neutered with 5 PF and didn't want to get fouled out. He always plays defense differently when he is on the brink of fouling out in a close game for this team and can't blame him. 2 of those 5 fouls were absolute shit calls imo but again they shouldn't have even been in a close game. Not sure what happened to Rui but dude is officially shitting the bed at this point. 38 minutes played, 3 points scored on 1-7 FG and 3 of those were point blank. Vando may return as the team is desperate but idk if he can help at all as he'd be jumping into a demanding playoff series right from the jump. Same with Wood. Yeah he did have 5 fouls and that was part of the problem but Jokic also just used immaculate footwork to keep him neutered. I’m only pointing to this specific matchup cause we only needed 1 stop down the stretch of the game but failed to get a single one. They scored every single time through Jokic and Murray. Lebron got scored on by Murray and rest were scored on AD by both. He played a legendary 1st half and followed it up with a mediocre 2nd half. Some of that was the team moving away from what worked but like I always do I ask wwkd? Kobe would demand that ball and he’d take it right to whomever was in his way. Lebron played that way down the stretch but no one else did. Rui is on my shit list until further notice. He makes 1 god damn point blank layup of the many he missed and we likely win the game.
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Post by history2b on Apr 23, 2024 14:27:48 GMT -8
I've not commented about these games, because like 2b said, it's been too painful. But all I can say is that I'm ready for this page to turn. If you can't win a game up by 20 points in the 3rd quarter of a game you had to have, then you don't deserve to win--period. I don't care how many calls the refs missed either. I don't want to hear about any refs, because they can't be an excuse at this point. You either get the job done or you don't. You either overcome bad calls or you don't. Otherwise, you just sound like a 2002 Sacramento King fan--they're still crying about 2002. And I'll just say it now--this is the difference between Lebron and Kobe. Kobe would not allow his team to lose a game like this--NEVER. I'm not letting Ham off the hook either, but superstar players of Lebron's magnitude simply do not let their teams lose a 20 point lead and lose in the playoffs. It's darn near impossible to overcome a 2-0 deficit in the way the Lakers have lost these 2 games. So, this series is over, even if they get a win at home. I'm ready to move on to the next chapter of the Laker franchise. No one loves Kobe more than me but I will not cannot throw Lebron under the bus on this one. He’s the only one with the balls to put up an elite fight at the end. Back to back deep 3s, mid range shot and 2 successful driving shots at the rim. Only missed that last 3 and it was a good look. For the oldest player in the league I was in awe that he had what it took to take it to these fuckers. But after AD absolutely schooled Nikola all first half he decided to stay hidden in these final tumultuous stretches. The one play he got the ball he was back to flailing on a bad attempt. Can’t have that, not when you are the top dog on the team with your geriatric teammate on his last legs. One basket / one stop changes the game. Also like chiefs said, Ham took his 2 timeouts with him to the grave. 1 could have made the difference. Lotta mistakes down the stretch in of the 4th but few were because of Lebron.
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Post by shaolinfighter on Apr 23, 2024 14:41:20 GMT -8
Ham could have also challenged that BS Murray and-1 that tied the game. Would have at least given his team a breather and he would have still had 1 timeout left even if they lost the challenge.
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Post by odogg on Apr 23, 2024 14:59:48 GMT -8
Hachi and the bench sucking big ballz
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Post by lakeshow on Apr 23, 2024 15:00:33 GMT -8
I've not commented about these games, because like 2b said, it's been too painful. But all I can say is that I'm ready for this page to turn. If you can't win a game up by 20 points in the 3rd quarter of a game you had to have, then you don't deserve to win--period. I don't care how many calls the refs missed either. I don't want to hear about any refs, because they can't be an excuse at this point. You either get the job done or you don't. You either overcome bad calls or you don't. Otherwise, you just sound like a 2002 Sacramento King fan--they're still crying about 2002. And I'll just say it now--this is the difference between Lebron and Kobe. Kobe would not allow his team to lose a game like this--NEVER. I'm not letting Ham off the hook either, but superstar players of Lebron's magnitude simply do not let their teams lose a 20 point lead and lose in the playoffs. It's darn near impossible to overcome a 2-0 deficit in the way the Lakers have lost these 2 games. So, this series is over, even if they get a win at home. I'm ready to move on to the next chapter of the Laker franchise. No one loves Kobe more than me but I will not cannot throw Lebron under the bus on this one. He’s the only one with the balls to put up an elite fight at the end. Back to back deep 3s, mid range shot and 2 successful driving shots at the rim. Only missed that last 3 and it was a good look. For the oldest player in the league I was in awe that he had what it took to take it to these fuckers. But after AD absolutely schooled Nikola all first half he decided to stay hidden in these final tumultuous stretches. The one play he got the ball he was back to flailing on a bad attempt. Can’t have that, not when you are the top dog on the team with your geriatric teammate on his last legs. One basket / one stop changes the game. Also like chiefs said, Ham took his 2 timeouts with him to the grave. 1 could have made the difference. Lotta mistakes down the stretch in of the 4th but few were because of Lebron. All fair points 2b. I’m just really frustrated right now. I agree Lebron made some great shots, but despite some questionable calls, we still should have won that game. Ham continues to also get out coached too. I just can’t watch this anymore.
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hackashaq
::| Basketball Guru |::
Posts: 3,212
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Post by hackashaq on Apr 23, 2024 17:01:44 GMT -8
I just don't think Lebron taking a step back 3 with 12 seconds left at the top of the key was the shot they wanted. Remember it's late in the game at high altitude....those shots start to lose efficacy as people are on their last breaths.
Also, the switch out with AD guarding Jamal, I still think that was a mistake.
But in the end, it's just proven that this Denver team is better than the Lakers and have years left in terms of their age and stages in their career.
They have the better 1-2 combo and more importantly, well at least equally importantly, they are better coached. Lebron is old and the Lakers are clinging on to an AD that seems to be missing that extra gear.
The current team is cooked. You could tell during the regular season as well.
We blew any chance of getting better when we dropped the ball getting Westbrook, and then Ham, and didn't have anything left for a run with Kyrie.
We really need to move on.
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Post by chiefsdodgerslakers24 on Apr 23, 2024 22:19:51 GMT -8
I just don't think Lebron taking a step back 3 with 12 seconds left at the top of the key was the shot they wanted. Remember it's late in the game at high altitude....those shots start to lose efficacy as people are on their last breaths. Also, the switch out with AD guarding Jamal, I still think that was a mistake. But in the end, it's just proven that this Denver team is better than the Lakers and have years left in terms of their age and stages in their career. They have the better 1-2 combo and more importantly, well at least equally importantly, they are better coached. Lebron is old and the Lakers are clinging on to an AD that seems to be missing that extra gear. The current team is cooked. You could tell during the regular season as well. We blew any chance of getting better when we dropped the ball getting Westbrook, and then Ham, and didn't have anything left for a run with Kyrie. We really need to move on. Joe Tsai and Sean Marks can both fuck themselves. Lakers had enough to get Kyrie, they just had jackasses who only traded him to a place he didn't want to go out of spite. you aren't telling me Dorian Finney Smith and Spencer Dinshittie moved any needles. Mavs fumbled Jalen Brunson and got bailed out by Brooklyn for his replacement
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hackashaq
::| Basketball Guru |::
Posts: 3,212
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Post by hackashaq on Apr 23, 2024 23:41:31 GMT -8
I just don't think Lebron taking a step back 3 with 12 seconds left at the top of the key was the shot they wanted. Remember it's late in the game at high altitude....those shots start to lose efficacy as people are on their last breaths. Also, the switch out with AD guarding Jamal, I still think that was a mistake. But in the end, it's just proven that this Denver team is better than the Lakers and have years left in terms of their age and stages in their career. They have the better 1-2 combo and more importantly, well at least equally importantly, they are better coached. Lebron is old and the Lakers are clinging on to an AD that seems to be missing that extra gear. The current team is cooked. You could tell during the regular season as well. We blew any chance of getting better when we dropped the ball getting Westbrook, and then Ham, and didn't have anything left for a run with Kyrie. We really need to move on. Joe Tsai and Sean Marks can both fuck themselves. Lakers had enough to get Kyrie, they just had jackasses who only traded him to a place he didn't want to go out of spite. you aren't telling me Dorian Finney Smith and Spencer Dinshittie moved any needles. Mavs fumbled Jalen Brunson and got bailed out by Brooklyn for his replacement But you're assuming our front office offered even that to Brooklyn. I don't think we know for sure. I do believe spite does have something to do it, but I can't fully believe a GM, with the debacle at Brooklyn that was partially due to his actions or inactions, would have fully jeopardized his job trying to go all in on spite. I don't underestimate Jeanie's and Pelinka's incompetence. I kinda feel like we are on the cusp of some dry years with little hope, like the Sedale Threatt, Nick Van Exel, Cedric Ceballos days. Things got better from there, but it did take the magic of Jerry West in his prime to turn it around.
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Post by chiefsdodgerslakers24 on Apr 24, 2024 13:01:44 GMT -8
Joe Tsai and Sean Marks can both fuck themselves. Lakers had enough to get Kyrie, they just had jackasses who only traded him to a place he didn't want to go out of spite. you aren't telling me Dorian Finney Smith and Spencer Dinshittie moved any needles. Mavs fumbled Jalen Brunson and got bailed out by Brooklyn for his replacement But you're assuming our front office offered even that to Brooklyn. I don't think we know for sure. I do believe spite does have something to do it, but I can't fully believe a GM, with the debacle at Brooklyn that was partially due to his actions or inactions, would have fully jeopardized his job trying to go all in on spite. I don't underestimate Jeanie's and Pelinka's incompetence. I kinda feel like we are on the cusp of some dry years with little hope, like the Sedale Threatt, Nick Van Exel, Cedric Ceballos days. Things got better from there, but it did take the magic of Jerry West in his prime to turn it around. you mean like the last years of Kobe's career and until we signed Lebron? yeah, that may legitimately be not far off if Lebron leaves or has the decline someone his age should have had unless the Lakers get really lucky.
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Post by shaolinfighter on Apr 24, 2024 13:28:53 GMT -8
Maybe Wood plays, but I'd be surprised if Vando plays. Lakers staying tight lipped.
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Post by shaolinfighter on Apr 24, 2024 13:34:43 GMT -8
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